Monday, September 05, 2005

Meaning of Katrina: A sign?

I was just curious and sought out the meaning of the name "Katrina". Here it is!

The name meaning and origin of Katrina Name:

Gender: (female)

Origin: German

Meaning: Pure

Well now, this just has to be too coincidental!! I went to the website above and searched for a post about the name Katrina. I found only one and this is what the person said while reviewing the name:

Katrina - It's ok, but nn Trina makes me think of Latrine...not a good thing

(Sorry folks...I found out today that the link to the post about "Katrina" making the person think of "Latrine" has been deleted!! Isn't that strange? Hmmm.....)

Of course, one could view the current state of the affected area as the complete opposite of "pure" because it is currently a cesspool of filthy and contaminated water.

However, the Bible tells us that God can take anything and turn it for good.

Some of the amazing stories we are already reading about have led to purification of some peoples' hearts and souls!!

Ultimately, could this lead to the purification of the city that was once a place known for rampant sin and decadence?

In the aftermath of such devastation, could a purified region emerge?

Here is a link to an article written by a well-respected pastor named Greg Laurie. It is entitled, "Hurrican Katrina: A sign of the Last Days?"

I decided to post it here, too:

Hurricane Katrina:A sign of the Last Days?

Posted: September 5, 20051:00 a.m. Eastern
By Greg Laurie

© 2000>© 2005

Hurricanes, tsunamis, earthquakes and global terrorism all cause us to wonder what on earth is happening. Sure, there has always been tragedy and cataclysmic events in our world, but, these days, it seems that a new crisis is exploding just as another is beginning to abate.

As we prepare to remember the horrific attack on American soil on 9-11, we may wonder could it be that all these things that are happening in our world today are actually signs of the times. Could these be reminders to us that Jesus Christ is coming back soon?

Consider the tsunami that struck Southeast Asia on Dec. 26 last year. It was caused by the fourth most powerful undersea earthquake on record. An earthquake so powerful it moved the entire island of Sumatra 100 feet to the southwest from its pre-quake position. Geologists said the tsunami was so powerful that it set the whole Earth to vibrating and it interfered with the Earth's rotation to the degree that time stopped for three microseconds.

According to the U.S. Geological Society, earthquakes are on the increase. For the past 50 years, every decade has increased in the number of earthquakes recorded. And not just minor ones, but "killer quakes" as well. And, this one has been one of the strongest ever, with more than 286,000 casualities in its wake. More will come.

And now in our own back yard, this tragic hurricane called Katrina may end up claiming thousands of lives as well.

Then there is the continuing threat of terrorism. The last attack happened in London, with threats of more to come.

When Jesus was asked what the signs of His return would be, He painted a picture of a world torn by strife and war; famine in the midst of plenty; the Earth rocked by great earthquakes and ravaged by pestilences. Jesus said: "And there will be great earthquakes in various places, and famines and pestilences; and there will be fearful sights and great signs from heaven" (Luke 21:11, NKJV). Jesus indicates that natural disasters along with global conflict will begin to increase in frequency and intensity in concert with each other shortly before His return.

And it is as these "birth pains" begin to take place that Christians are to know their deliverance is near!

Jesus said "Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near" (Luke 21:28, NKJV).
I had the opportunity to be a guest on "Larry King Live" in August, and a caller directed a question to me about what is happening in our world today. I was asked if we are, indeed, seeing signs of the times, predicted in the Bible, reminding us that the coming of Christ is near. I told her, "I believe that we are." And Larry pointedly said to me, "It's been 2005 years"! And I responded, "Yes, and we are 2005 years closer"! We have never been closer to the return of Jesus Christ to the Earth than we are right now. So, what are we to do?

Certainly, we want to do everything we can for the victims of this latest tragedy along the gulf coast of Alabama, Mississippi and Louisiana. You will find Christian churches and relief organizations like Samaritan's Purse, World Vision, and the Salvation Army leading the way. And, we all should offer them and others our prayerful and financial support.

Sometimes people accuse Christians of having their heads in the sand, oblivious to the problems of the world around us. As it is often stated, they are so "heavenly minded, they are no earthly good." Nothing could be further from the truth.

In fact, the very opposite is the case. When you truly are "heavenly minded," you will be of the greatest earthly good. You will find those who have done the most for this world have been those who thought the most of the next one.

You will not see any atheist relief groups rushing to provide aid to our friends devastated by Katrina. There is no "Non-believer's Purse," or "Secular Vision" or "Atheists' Army" out there helping those in need. But there are thousands of Christian churches and para-church organizations that are already doing what they do best – offering help and hope to those in need.

Another thing we must consider as we see these signs of the times, or these "birth pains," is these are reminders to us that the return of Jesus is near and we need to be ready spiritually.

The Bible teaches that there is a generation of people who will not see death, but rather will meet the Lord in what is often referred to as the rapture of the Church.

Could we be that generation? Time will tell. But if I were you, I would pay careful attention to all that is happening – you will be glad that you did!

Editor's note: Those wishing to contribute to hurricane relief efforts can donate to the Salvation Army or by calling 1-800-725-2769.

Greg Laurie is the senior pastor of Harvest Christian Fellowship in Riverside, Calif., one of the eight largest churches in America, as well as the third largest in California. You can find additional material by Greg Laurie online at Allen David Books.


Christinewjc said...

I found this letter-to-the-editor at WND intersting!


Modern Babylon?

Read Revelation 18 and substitute in the words "New Orleans" for "Babylon." It reads like the newspaper for the past few days.

By the way, "Orleans" means "City or Metropolis" in French. In this passage, Babylon is referred to as "the strong city," "the great city," etc.

Babylon means "confusion" or "mixture" – ever seen a Mardi Gras celebration? Also, Cajun is the language of New Orleans: a "mixture" of English, French and other languages. Babylon was known for it's pagan culture. What U.S. city is more pagan than New Orleans? (perhaps Las Vegas)

Especially interesting is that New Orleans is the fourth-largest port in the world and THE LARGEST PORT in the U.S. with all kinds of goods flowing up and down the Mississippi River – and we all know about the oil imports coming in through New Orleans (see verses 11-19). Also, the city is now on fire (see verse 8, 18), and also interesting is that New Orleans is the jazz capital of the world – look at verse 22.

Plagues and pestilences and famine are in the city (see verse 8).

Is Revelation chapter 18 a prophecy of the destruction of New Orleans? If it is, and if Revelation is written in chronological order, then note Chapter 19 talks about the marriage supper of the Lamb and of the Second Coming of Christ.

Robert Mapstead

Susan Smith said...

If, if, if... the world loves to speculate and judge when tragedy strikes. My heart is very sad today, because not once have I heard a prayer or even a request for prayer for my country (USA) here in the City of God, Jerusalem. The spirit of criticism, condemnation and judgementalism is very much alive in the hearts of Christians worldwide at this hour.

I am thankful we worship a God of restoration, a God who restores the years the locust take. My life has been restored after more than 20 years of practicing homosexuality. Where is love and mercy in the One Church Body? God have mercy and let us know how deceitful and wicked our hearts are (See JER 17:9). Give me forgiveness in my heart toward those who condemn and judge my beloved country.

Blessings from the "Holy" City of God.(ss)

Christinewjc said...

Hi Susan,

You stated: "If, if, if... the world loves to speculate and judge when tragedy strikes."

Are you upset about Mr. Mapstead's letter? I thought it was important for him to include the "if" terms because that makes him question his own judgment of the event.

I realize that we will probably disagree on this particular issue, but I do see these catastrophic events as a kind of judgment on our land. For too long we have let secular humanism allow our culture to slide down that slippery slope of sin, evil and death. Most Christians here would rather keep silent on these issues rather than stand up for biblical morals and values. IMHO, I think that we are reaping the consequences of inaction on the part of the Christian churches in general, as well as Christian people in particular, here.

I do see a parallel between the events of the forced Gaza pullout and this terrible hurricane. As our pastor stated Sunday morning, God may not have caused it, but God allowed it to happen.

The results of the Gaza pullout made refugees of Jewish people in their own land! The results of this terrible hurricane and the aftermath of the flooding made refugees of people in our own land! America backed up the decision to force Jewish people from Jewish land. That is not a sign of "blessing God's people and you will be blessed."

Pastor Miles McPherson had a great sermon in church. He covered the hurricane and mentioned many of the possible reasons why God allowed it to happen.

He also completed a 2 part series on Islam and how "committed" they are to their 'jihad' cause. He started with the history (all the way back to Ishmael and Issac) of the conflict and explained that Islam is NOT a religion of peace. Yes, they do have their fanatics, but even their book, the Quran, INSTRUCTS them to "kill the infidels" which include Americans, Jews and Christians. I know that I am getting off topic, but I wanted to illustrate a point.

He shocked us all by saying that if Christians in this nation were as committed to leading others to faith in Jesus Christ we could have one of the biggest revivals in American history. Not by sword. Not by force. Not by hate. Not by bickering or bashing. But by the power of God's Word and the person of Jesus Christ and what he did for us at the cross!!

I'm probably not doing a good job summing up the sermon here, but I hope you can see the not-so-subtle message.

You see, God can lift His hand of protection from us today, just as He did in the Old Testament times.

The purpose was for His people to draw near to Him again THROUGH repentance. God does love us and the ultimate demonstration of His love is sending Jesus Christ for our salvation. However, God also love holiness, righteousness and justice. Jesus told us, "If you love me, you will keep my commandments." How many Christians in the USA today look and act JUST LIKE unsaved secular humanists in their everyday lives? If we are to be honest, we would have to answer, A LOT!

Many self-professed Christians break the Ten Commandments every day and pay no heed to the Lord's call to be holy and righteous in this sinful generation. Many who call themselves 'Christians' commit adultery, fornication, lie, steal, view pornography, celebrate and promote homosexuality, take the name of the Lord in vain, dishonor their parents, and the list goes on.

Are we not called to be salt and light to point the way towards salvation in Christ in this world? Aren't are bodies to be "temples of the Holy Spirit"? No wonder we are often called, "hypocrites".

God wants us to be HOLY and RIGHTEOUS for Him... but it's important to know that is NOT meant to mean that we are to be this way in order TO BE SAVED, BUT BECAUSE WE ARE SAVED.

I'm getting into some of the points that I want to make in my future post for this blog.

I'll end this reply just to say that some people don't like to read about Christians speculating what the recent disasters ( tsunami, Gaza pullout, hurricane)mean. But I think that we ALL (including Christians!) NEED TO TAKE A HARD LOOK at ourselves to see what God is trying to show us and what message(s)/lesson(s) can be taught to each and every one of us from these events!

Susan Smith said...

Hi Christine:

I do not think "upset" is the proper term to describe my feelings of sadness over the harsh and critical words I am reading about my country.

Can you name a country on earth that has blessed Israel more than the USA? When I moved to Israel more than three years ago, I was what one would call a gung-ho Christian Zionist.

Today, I KNOW God is in control and I believe the Gaza pullout is in HIS divine purpose. One can make the land an idol. The earth is the Lord's and the fullness thereof. (ss)

Christinewjc said...

Can you be more specific about the criticisms you are reading about your country? Are you talking about the U.S.? Which criticisms against America are you referring to? Unfortunately, there are PLENTY to go around and they are varied as can be!

I'm just trying to understand what is bothering you, Susan. Are you referring to the criticism that is rampant against the Bush Administration and evident in our news media? Or, the criticism over the war in Iraq? Or, the criticism being hurled at us by the Muslim terrorists? Or, the criticism that evangelical Christians have pointed out over the moral relativism that has taken hold in America through liberal secular legislation, judges and education? Or, ALL of the above?

One more thing. Do you see the increase in natural disasters and the decisions and happenings involving the land of Israel as signs of the "birth pains" of the End Times?

Jesus told us to watch for such things as these. The Scriptures are quite descriptive of what to watch for (as evident in Robert's Revelation 18 post). Of course, no one knows the "day or hour" but Jesus DID tell us to watch for the signs where our redemption could be near.

Do you think that the increase of all of these signs as predicted in Scripture is possible evidence that the marriage supper of the Lamb and of the Second Coming of Christ is getting closer?

Susan stated: "Today, I KNOW God is in control and I believe the Gaza pullout is in HIS divine purpose. One can make the land an idol. The earth is the Lord's and the fullness thereof."

Let me ask you this. Do you think that it is possible that God, in His permissive will, allows the errors, sins, and mistakes of mankind (and their governments) to occur? Of course all of human history will lead to His ultimate divine purpose, but is all that happens to be considered His perfect will for us? I guess what I am trying to ask you is this: isn't the Bible filled with situations where Gods' Perfect Will wasn't followed and thus Israel, as a nation, needed to be rebuked and needed to be called back to repentance for her sins?

It is true that Gods' Perfect Will, WILL be accomplished, despite the fact that so many of mankind currently live in disobedience and rebellion to it. In Gods' permissive will, evil, sin and death is allowed here for now. Even Jesus said, "in this world, you will have trouble, but take heart for I have overcome the world."

The evil, sin and death won't be gone forever until all is accomplished. It is through the Law, the Prophets and the Church (people, not a building) of Jesus Christ that people are called to repentance. We are to be salt and light within this world to those who are lost and perishing.

Yes. God is ultimately in control of the destiny of human history. But Jesus gave us the commandment to go and make diciples of all nations baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Spirit. Evangelism is our assignment here on earth. Part of that evangelism is pointing out the need for people to see their sinfulness because they have broken the Holy Law of God. Without that Law and their realization of their sin, they cannot be truly born again in Jesus Christ. They risk becoming "false converts" as is pointed out in "The Way of the Master" book.

Here I go again! Posting my next blog subject here in a reply! OK. I'll end here for now and I await your reply.

Please know that I love and respect you, my sister in Christ, and I am not doing this to start an argument between us but to seriously discuss our differences on this issue.

Love in Him,

Christinewjc said...

I found this quote in an article I was reading today:

"A venerable confession of faith states it rightly: "God from eternity, decrees or permits all things that come to pass, and perpetually upholds, directs, and governs all creatures and all events; yet so as not in any way to be the author or approver of sin nor to destroy the free will and responsibility of intelligent creatures."

I think that is a good definition of what is meant by Gods' "permissive" will.

Thomas said...

Wow, Christine, you are totally nuts. You are much more fun to watch than Stephen Bennett, because he seemed to have a soul, and so I felt sorry for him. You clearly do not have soul, nor any empathy for anyone outside your wacky cult, and so I will not in the least feel sorry for you when the Good Lord unleashes His Holy Wrath and washes you, your house, and your entire Precious Moments collection down the river with the next flood.

Tens of thousands of innocent people are dead, Christine. Millions of poor and needy people have lost everything they had. A great American city has been wiped out. And you sit hear playing word games with your bonkers book of Revelations and blaming the Israeli government. It's clear that the only reason you opposed the Gaza pullout is that you hate the Arabs more than you hate the Jews. Well, toots, the pullout was the democratic decision of the Jewish nation, and for some Christian shiksa like you to whine about it sure takes a lot of chutzpah.

Is it not the case that the only reason you support Israeli expansionism is to help Jesus wipe out the unrepentant Jews at the end of time? Some kind of prophecy fulfillment thing? Israel would be much better off as a secular republic, the way it used to be. Instead, it's being infested by crazies of all the various monotheisms. "Christian Zionism" is truly a case of "thanks, but no thanks."

Do you ever think for yourself, Christine, or do you get all your facts from Wing Nut Daily and your foaming at the mouth mad dog pastor? You've painted such a nasty picture of your god that it's a good thing he doesn't exist -- otherwise, you could be facing some serious eternities down in Hell for character defamation.

In joyous, secular humanist sin,

PS. Why don't you listen to an album of New Orleans jazz and then dare to tell us that the wonderful city had it coming?

Christinewjc said...

Thomas stated: "In joyous, secular humanist sin,"

At least you admit to the current condition of your soul.

Your words of condemnation and insult towards me have no power here, Thomas.

Now scurry off into the dark corners of your evil perverted world.

Matthew 5:10 - Blessed [are] they which are persecuted for righteousness' sake: for theirs is the kingdom of heaven.

Mat 5:11 Blessed are ye, when [men] shall revile you, and persecute [you], and shall say all manner of evil against you falsely, for my sake.

Mat. 5:13 - Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.

Mat 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

Mat. 7:26 - And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand:

Rom. 1:21 - Because that, when they knew God, they glorified [him] not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

1 Ti 2:23 - But they that will be rich fall into temptation and a snare, and [into] many foolish and hurtful lusts, which drown men in destruction and perdition.

Mat 3:2 And saying, Repent ye: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Mat 4:17 From that time Jesus began to preach, and to say, Repent: for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.

Mar 1:15 And saying, The time is fulfilled, and the kingdom of God is at hand: repent ye, and believe the gospel.

Mar 6:12 And they went out, and preached that men should repent.

Act 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord;

Act 8:22 Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee.

Act 17:30 And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

Rev 3:3 Remember therefore how thou hast received and heard, and hold fast, and repent. If therefore thou shalt not watch, I will come on thee as a thief, and thou shalt not know what hour I will come upon thee.

Rev 3:19 As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten: be zealous therefore, and repent.

The bad news:

Rev. 20:11-15

The Final Judgment
11 And I saw a great white throne, and I saw the one who was sitting on it. The earth and sky fled from his presence, but they found no place to hide. 12 I saw the dead, both great and small, standing before God's throne. And the books were opened, including the Book of Life. And the dead were judged according to the things written in the books, according to what they had done. 13 The sea gave up the dead in it, and death and the grave* gave up the dead in them. They were all judged according to their deeds. 14 And death and the grave were thrown into the lake of fire. This is the second death-the lake of fire. 15 And anyone whose name was not found recorded in the Book of Life was thrown into the lake of fire.

20:13 Greek and Hades; also in 20:14.

The Good News:

Romans 8:1 - [There is] therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

Revelation 22

And the angel showed me a pure river with the water of life, clear as crystal, flowing from the throne of God and of the Lamb, 2 coursing down the center of the main street. On each side of the river grew a tree of life, bearing twelve crops of fruit,* with a fresh crop each month. The leaves were used for medicine to heal the nations.
3 No longer will anything be cursed. For the throne of God and of the Lamb will be there, and his servants will worship him. 4 And they will see his face, and his name will be written on their foreheads. 5 And there will be no night there-no need for lamps or sun-for the Lord God will shine on them. And they will reign forever and ever.
6 Then the angel said to me, "These words are trustworthy and true: `The Lord God, who tells his prophets what the future holds, has sent his angel to tell you what will happen soon.' "

Jesus Is Coming
7 "Look, I am coming soon! Blessed are those who obey the prophecy written in this scroll."

8 I, John, am the one who saw and heard all these things. And when I saw and heard these things, I fell down to worship the angel who showed them to me. 9 But again he said, "No, don't worship me. I am a servant of God, just like you and your brothers the prophets, as well as all who obey what is written in this scroll. Worship God!"
10 Then he instructed me, "Do not seal up the prophetic words you have written, for the time is near. 11 Let the one who is doing wrong continue to do wrong; the one who is vile, continue to be vile; the one who is good, continue to do good; and the one who is holy, continue in holiness."

12 "See, I am coming soon, and my reward is with me, to repay all according to their deeds. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."

14 Blessed are those who wash their robes so they can enter through the gates of the city and eat the fruit from the tree of life. 15 Outside the city are the dogs-the sorcerers, the sexually immoral, the murderers, the idol worshipers, and all who love to live a lie.

16 "I, Jesus, have sent my angel to give you this message for the churches. I am both the source of David and the heir to his throne.* I am the bright morning star."

17 The Spirit and the bride say, "Come." Let each one who hears them say, "Come." Let the thirsty ones come-anyone who wants to. Let them come and drink the water of life without charge. 18 And I solemnly declare to everyone who hears the prophetic words of this book: If anyone adds anything to what is written here, God will add to that person the plagues described in this book. 19 And if anyone removes any of the words of this prophetic book, God will remove that person's share in the tree of life and in the holy city that are described in this book.
20 He who is the faithful witness to all these things says, "Yes, I am coming soon!"
Amen! Come, Lord Jesus!
21 The grace of the Lord Jesus be with you all.

22:2 Or 12 kinds of fruit.
22:16 Greek I am the root and offspring of David.

Copyright Information

Holy Bible, New Living Translation ?, copyright ? 1996 by Tyndale Charitable Trust. Used by permission of Tyndale House Publishers. All rights reserved.

Full copyright information is provided here. Visit the New Living Translation website.

Christinewjc said...

Oh yeah, Thomas. And what were the kind of people YOU hang out with (you know...the kind that involve themselves in joyous, secular humanist sin,) doing in the aftermath of this disaster?

Take a look....makes me want to VOMIT!!

Homosexuals celebrate in ravaged New Orleans
2 dozen 'gays' march up Bourbon Street, reslate Southern Decadence for tomorrow

Posted: September 6, 2005
1:00 a.m. Eastern

By Joe Kovacs
© 2005

Partiers enjoy a previous 'Southern Decadence' festival in New Orleans (courtesy

Despite the devastation and ongoing suffering by thousands from Hurricane Katrina, homosexuals paraded on Bourbon Street in New Orleans over the weekend, and have rescheduled their "Southern Decadence" event for tomorrow.

"It's New Orleans, man. We're going to celebrate," Matt Menold, a 23-year musician wearing a sombrero and a guitar slung on his back, told the Associated Press.

An account of the small parade on the homosexual newssite noted:

It was a scene like something from a Fellini movie. Amid the death, the destruction, and suffering in the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina a small parade behind a tattered rainbow flag made its way up Bourbon Street on Sunday.
The marchers said they were celebrating Southern Decadence. The group – about two dozen people – all said they lived in the largely gay French Quarter. Defiant, they said they were not about to flee the community despite orders from the city to do so.

One marcher carried a sign proclaiming, "Life Goes On?"

"The shocking callousness of New Orleans' gay activists towards the severe suffering of its fellow citizens cannot be adequately articulated in a news report," says James Hartline, a former homosexual, who describes the "Southern Decadence" festival as being "replete with tens of thousands of men and women engaged in public nudity, prostitution, illegal drug use and destructive public S & M sex."

"The idea that human beings are continuing to party while hundreds of thousands of fellow citizens are starving, dying and suffering from a multitude of sicknesses brings into focus the real lack of judgment that these constant advocates of special gay rights demonstrate in a time of crisis."

According to Agape Press, Hartline himself has AIDS and is now warning homosexuals about the consequences of their lifestyle.

As WorldNetDaily previously reported, Hurricane Katrina walloped New Orleans just two days before the annual homosexual "Southern Decadence" festival was to begin in the town, an act characterized by some as God's work.

The event has been slated to go on tomorrow in the nearby town of Lafayette, La., featuring "Floatin' Floozies," according to the event's website.

As writer John d'Addario explained in "Southern Decadence 2005: A How-To Guide" posted on

Parades and non-stop parties aside, Southern Decadence may be most famous (or infamous) for the displays of naked flesh which characterize the event – which is only fitting, since New Orleans in early September is generally the closest thing you'll ever experience to walking around in a steambath outside of a health spa. While police have started to crack down on public lewdness and pressure from a local crackpot conservative religious organization has caused the five-day festival to become a little more sedate than it was in years past, the atmosphere of Southern Decadence has stayed true to its name and public displays of sexuality are pretty much everywhere you look.
The event has been endorsed by Mayor Ray Nagin, who promoted the activities in a letter stating: "There is no place like this on Earth! Southern Decadence XXXII is an exciting event. We welcome you and know that you can anticipate great food, great music and great times in New Orleans."

Those wishing to contribute to hurricane relief efforts can donate to the Salvation Army online or by calling 1-800-725-2769. Red Cross donations can be made online or by calling 1-800-435-7669.

Job 20:4:-29 NLT - 4 "Don't you realize that ever since people were first placed on the earth, 5 the triumph of the wicked has been short-lived and the joy of the godless has been only temporary? 6 Though the godless man's pride reaches to the heavens and though his head touches the clouds, 7 yet he will perish forever, thrown away like his own dung. Those who knew him will ask, `Where is he?' 8 He will fade like a dream and not be found. He will vanish like a vision in the night. 9 Neither his friends nor his family will ever see him again. 10 His children will beg from the poor, for he must give back his ill-gotten wealth. 11 He was just a young man, but his bones will lie in the dust.
12 "He enjoyed the taste of his wickedness, letting it melt under his tongue. 13 He savored it, holding it long in his mouth. 14 But suddenly, the food he has eaten turns sour within him, a poisonous venom in his stomach. 15 He will vomit the wealth he swallowed. God won't let him keep it down. 16 He will suck the poison of snakes. The viper will kill him. 17 He will never again enjoy abundant streams of olive oil or rivers of milk and honey. 18 His labors will not be rewarded. His wealth will bring him no joy. 19 For he oppressed the poor and left them destitute. He foreclosed on their homes. 20 He was always greedy but never satisfied. Of all the things he dreamed about, nothing remains. 21 Nothing is left after he finishes gorging himself; therefore, his prosperity will not endure.
22 "In the midst of plenty, he will run into trouble, and disasters will destroy him. 23 May God give him a bellyful of trouble. May God rain down his anger upon him. 24 He will try to escape, but God's arrow will pierce him. 25 The arrow is pulled from his body, and the arrowhead glistens with blood.* The terrors of death are upon him.
26 "His treasures will be lost in deepest darkness. A wildfire will devour his goods, consuming all he has left. 27 The heavens will reveal his guilt, and the earth will give testimony against him. 28 A flood will sweep away his house. God's anger will descend on him in torrents. 29 This is the fate that awaits the wicked. It is the inheritance decreed by God."

20:25 Hebrew with gall.

Susan Smith said...

God's will is God's will... I have never been able to find in scripture much support for the idea of God's "permissive" and his "perfect" will in my life even though I am aware there are many Christians who believe there is such a thing. God is not limited by time and every single day we live is no surprise to him. HE knows the future.

"One can make the land an idol. The earth is the Lord's and the fullness thereof." I wrote in my previous post. This morning I am in charge of devotions for our HQ staff here in Jerusalem. I plan to share that the written Word of God can also become an idol. My mentor told me this years ago, and she is correct.

Thank you for assuring me you are not trying to start an argument, Christine. I do not contribute to blogs in order to debate... I contribute to be a blessing, not a curse and I do the best I am able to follow the leading of the Lord with my choice of words. Words are powerful regardless of who uses them.

Truth is truth, regardless of who speaks it. There are times when silence ministers much more than words. Yours in Christ,


Christinewjc said...

Hi Susan,

Thanks for responding. I'm glad you were able to find the comment among the tirade of Thomas.

Stephen warned me long ago that Thomas wasn't a person "seeking", just a person who tends to mock, disparage and destroy the witness of Christian believers. It took a while for me to reach the same conclusion, thus, I have taken the advice of the Bible and have "shaken the dust from my sandals and left that house" to speak.

Mat 10:14 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.

Mar 6:11 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear you, when ye depart thence, shake off the dust under your feet for a testimony against them. Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.

Luk 9:5 And whosoever will not receive you, when ye go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet for a testimony against them.

First, I want to admit that I could be wrong and you, absolutely right about the "permissive" will idea. But, I have found evidence of this throughout Scripture in the accounts of the disobedience, reprimands of the Lord, repentance of the people and reconciliation back to relationship with God in the Old Testament. I also find evidence of God's permissive will within the Lord's prayer:

Matthew 6:10 KJV - Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done in earth, as [it is] in heaven.

Jesus was praying that the Father's will be done here on the earth as it is in heaven. This indicates to me that God's Perfect Will IS DONE, ALWAYS, in heaven. After inequity was found in Lucifer and he was cast out of heaven as Satan (along with 1/3 of the angels who fell with him and became demons), Scripture tells us that the remaining angels were "sealed" by God. But obviously, since man was tempted by Satan to sin and we live in a fallen world here, God's Perfect Will is not always done here on earth.

1 Timothy 5:21 KJV - I charge [thee] before God, and the Lord Jesus Christ, and the elect angels, that thou observe these things without preferring one before another, doing nothing by partiality.

God's angels can no longer "fall" today. Following the angelic revolt of Lucifer (now Satan), God "elected" or permanently confirmed the holiness of the angels who chose to remain loyal to Him. God has apparently given them a special grace of perseverance to enable them to permanently retain their position as holy angels.

The question that arises in my mind is if God's Perfect Will was always done here would we need to pray for it to be done here?

Jesus told us that "in this world, you will have trouble. But take heart! For I have overcome the world!"

The ultimate victory is clear because of Jesus sacrificial death and resurrection, but it will be realized totally and unequivocably (even by nonbelievers) at the culmination of all of history at the Lord's second coming.

I previously shared:

"A venerable confession of faith states it rightly: "God from eternity, decrees or permits all things that come to pass, and perpetually upholds, directs, and governs all creatures and all events; yet so as not in any way to be the author or approver of sin nor to destroy the free will and responsibility of intelligent creatures."

And I stated:

"I think that is a good definition of what is meant by Gods' "permissive" will."

I think what I may have left out is the important fact that God's current "permissive" will exists within His Perfect Will. It's not to be regarded as a separate entity.

Revelation reveals the idea of permissive will in the following verse:

Revelation 22:11, 12

11 Let the one who is doing wrong continue to do wrong; the one who is vile, continue to be vile; the one who is good, continue to do good; and the one who is holy, continue in holiness."

And the judgment at the culmination of all of human history reveals what will eventually be done:

12 "See, I am coming soon, and my reward is with me, to repay all according to their deeds. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End."

There are probably many more examples that I could post, but I just wanted to share these few for the purpose of clarity.

Again, if I am misinformed about this then I apologize and I thank you for pointing out my error.

Love in the Lord,

Saltnlight said...

We are living in the last days and Christ's return cannot be far off.

What gives you the authority to diagnose?? Oh yes, I forgot. the APA allows homosexuals freedom to practice whatever they want so perhaps this includes the practice of medicine?? What title of diety do you hold that permits you to see the soul or lack of one in anyone??

Please don't tell me you are the bishop from New Hampshire, Robinson who thinks he is above God and can do his filth seeing as how he is a bishop and therefore God will have to let him through the gates of glory??

Define "cult".

What do you know about:
"Good Lord His Holy Wrath". You have mouthed a few things here you claim not to believe in but it looks as though you believe enough to call Him on His own. The difference between she and you Thomas is, that no matter what she were to lose, I would believe that none of it would mean as much to her as would her own death as she once was before Christ set her free. She hasn't got what you have to worry her. You are destined for a Christless eternity with the demons of hell in your present condition.

Placing curses on her will gain you nothing at all.

Your idea of "great" is proof of an illness deep within your own soul Thomas. One that can only be healed by the blood of the Lamb.

"It's clear that the only reason you opposed the Gaza pullout is that you hate the Arabs more than you hate the Jews."
It is your hatred of Christ that makes you able to form your mouth to say this Thomas. Thoughtless blather from the pit.

Thomas you have been hood winked into thinking that your atheism is your own claim. It is not, it comes from the evil one who has his claws into your soul. You have been blinded by him and you think you see and hear but you are blind and deaf. "Woe unto you who call evil good and good evil". Do you know what woe means Thomas??

What you consider a wonderful city.
New Orleans was second to few if any in the practice of ungodliness, even it's police were/are corrupt. It's Governor was/is a weener and did not carry out what was to be a total evacuation of N.O. The Mayor is a liar and a demonrat domocrat.
Who knows what God did or did not.
I say He was and is in control.

You need to wake up Thomas and cease the rock throwing. Your hatred of Christine will win you nothing.

Susan Smith said...


Good morning, my West Coast sister! I am glad you finally decided to get up today. It is almost my bedtime across the ocean, but I was pleased to see your post before I log off for the night. No apology is necessary, Christine. Debating or arguing or even discussions with many words about God's "perfect" or "permissive" will, simply do not interest me. It does not matter to me, who is right or wrong. I refuse to have anything to do with foolish or stupid disputes, because I know they produce quarrels (see 2TI 2:23).

Christ crucified is all that matters to me, because He is my life. Praise His Name. I often sin when I use many words, so I will close by telling you it is a joy to call you my "sister"... even if 'crazy lady' sometimes brings a smile to my face. I am going to log off now, BEFORE you reply and get me tickled before bedtime! God bless you, my friend. Much love from the Middle East,


Saltnlight said...

To whom it may concern:
I find myself having to agree with both of my sisters in Christ here. To not be further involved with disputes.
No longer will I become engaged with people who only wish to quarrel.

In the love of Christ Jesus,

Christinewjc said...

Another great article to share. It brings to mind the thought that maybe God is going to cleanse us in the wake of this New Orleans, Louisiana/Mississippi/Alabama disaster...


In the Fight
God and Katrina

By Matt Friedeman
September 8, 2005

(AgapePress) - New Orleans City Council President Oliver Thomas has seen what Katrina has done to his city. "Maybe," he has noted, "God's going to cleanse us."

This columnist has talked to many serious Christians about the tragedy of Katrina and the devastation it has wrought on Mississippi and Louisiana. The camps of thought seem two: God doesn't do things like this; and, God may well have done it, given the "sin city" nature of New Orleans and the casino-blighted coastline of Mississippi.

It is most unpalatable, of course, to suggest divine wrath. But biblically there is such a thing, and to assume that such Godly interference with evil will never happen again in our "enlightened" age is folly. New Orleans, for one, was one formidable "sin city." To begin the litany of God-mockery is to wonder where to finally stop: the occult and voodoo, Mardi Gras and the annual Southern Decadence festival (basically a homosexual Mardi Gras), ten times the national average of murders, a reputation for the worst government corruption, casinos with their bribes of public officials, the famous Bourbon Street which has evolved into a long line of porn shops and strip joints, police officers so uncommitted as to join in recent looting, and a city heaving with crime.

Perhaps it is just coincidence, but "Katrina" comes from the Greek which means "purity." New Orleans could use some of that.

It now has a tremendous opportunity.

Mississippi Governor Haley Barbour has done an extraordinary job, unlike his Louisiana counterpart, of providing leadership and hope to the people of Mississippi in these post-Katrina days even as the coast of his state resembles, in his words, "Hiroshima." He has said that Mississippi will return to be "bigger and better" than before.

Today, we who are further north in the state are concerned with the suffering of the coast dwellers and their rising from the rubble. Mississippians are a tough lot; they will, indeed, arise. But eventually, there needs to be a discussion on the "better" part of the "bigger and better" equation.

The casinos are today gutted of activity and need to rebuild to have a future. The first item of the gamblers' agenda this legislative session will be to coordinate a statewide effort to get those casinos land-based instead of resting on water. If "bigger and better" means to automatically grant them this request and thus engrave the practice of gambling further into the state's collective psyche, then I wonder if the state will miss out on a great opportunity. It should be noted that if the casinos can't be land-based, many of them may well leave altogether.

One would hope that, when thinking in terms of "better," morality would be the first thing to come to mind and not an afterthought to the tax revenue casinos purport to bring to the state's coffers.

God is speaking. Whether He caused the hurricane or not makes for interesting theological discussion, but this columnist for one will not speak for Him. Even so -- He is definitely speaking. And as we bow in humility and worship before the Almighty and ask for His revelation, do we hear His voice articulating that we should go back to decadence in New Orleans and casinos in Mississippi?

Here's hoping that we are not that deaf. Or, that stupid.

Matt Friedeman ( is a professor at Wesley Biblical Seminary. Respond to this column at his blog at ""
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