The thread began with the following observation (plus a copy of an essay at WorldNetDaily - go to link above to read WND essay):
I have to admit that prior to reading this article, I did not know the genuine reason why Pope John Paul II was not more condemning of the homosexual pedophile priests and the Cardinals who shuffled them around to other churches where such priests, unfortunately, were enabled to molest more and more young boys. This scandal absolutely sickened most of the public and the suffering of the victims was just horrendous!
I just couldn't understand, for the life of me, why Pope John II acted indifferent towards the scandal. I wasn't aware of the genuine reason he refused to believe that it was actually going on. The following certainly explains a lot and helped clear up the mystery:
Quote:
"Whenever Vatican investigators brought the results of their vetting process regarding an individual's candidacy for bishop, cardinal or other office, and they revealed he was a homosexual, John Paul II would refuse to believe it," he writes.
"He did so because accusing someone of homosexuality was a standard practice of the Communist government in his native Poland regarding anyone it regarded as an enemy of the state. From his ordination as a Catholic priest in 1946 to elevation to Archbishop of Krakow in 1963 and Cardinal in 1967, the then Karol Wojtyla witnessed this personal destruction repeatedly. So traumatized, he summarily dismissed such accusations as pope, and would approve the elevation of anyone so accused."
Christine
*******
Since GM was continually talking to himself within the thread, five years and six pages later, I posted the following:
Satan's grip on souls through sexual perversion
Sexual sin/perversion is one of the most difficult sins to overcome. No doubt about it.
__________________
See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ. Colossians 2:8
The eyes of the Lord move to and fro throughout the earth to show Himself strong to those whose hearts are fully committed to Him. 2 Chronicles 16:9
Then, GMpilot had this to say in reply:
So who needs Satan?Quote:
admin: Sexual sin/perversion is one of the most difficult sins to overcome. No doubt about it.
But it's all part of The Plan™, isn't it?
God will make it all turn out in the end, won't he?
All that social turmoil, all those disgraced clergymen, all those shattered lives...God will use it all for good, yeah? Isn't that what you always say?
Yet after five years and fifty posts where I point out how widely and deeply and how many decades this has been going on, all you can say is how difficult sexual sin is to overcome? (I wasn't aware that any sin was easy to overcome!)
Your original posts were so full of fire and vinegar, and now they've dwindled to two little sentences that say nothing. Both the Catholic God and yours make it clear, and you've repeated it on this site often enough; they should die. After all, civil laws were broken, too.
When sex is not permitted to express itself in its proper way, it will always eventually express itself in an improper way. The more it's suppressed, the nastier it blooms. No Satan necessary.
I must admit, "So, who needs Satan?" is an interesting question. In reality, an entire book could be written in reply to such a question. Readers, feel free to share your thoughts about that.
Rather than addressing that particular question [mostly because Satan is, unfortunately, often used as an excuse by those who repeatedly choose to sin. You know - the ole' "the devil made me do it" syndrome], I chose to reply utilizing the Gospel message:
GM,
If the priests were after normal sexual relations, they wouldn't be performing homosexual acts with male children or young teenage and pre-teen boys. Why weren't they going after the beautiful women - who were of the age of consent - from the pews of the churches? Answer: because they were in homosexual/pederasty/pedophile lust for teens and boys.
Those priests who went after pre-pubescent girls were also pedophiles.
But all of this is pointless to discuss with you. You seem to think that because there are priests who are fakes - all must be fakes as well. During my childhood, I learned about a pedophile priest in our church. I only knew that he went after pre-pubescent girls, but perhaps he attacked some boys too. It was all hushed up and they named a street after him in town after he had died.
I also knew of a wonderful priest who kept his celibate vows and was wonderful (in an appropriate manner and way) to all parishioners - especially the children. He died 10 years ago and had a monument placed in a small existing park that was later named after him. There were benches there that were donated by members of the church. He was deeply loved.
There are people who try to live good lives, and there are people who don't. We all fall short of the glory of God. Recall the "good" test I told you to take? No one passes that test. If anyone ever claims that they did pass it - then you know that they lied.
This is why humankind needs the Savior. Jesus Christ was the only sinless God-Man who died on the cross for the forgiveness of sins of all who repent of their sins and believe in him.
Jesus Christ is the living example of mercy and grace through God.
Mercy is God withholding what you (we all) deserve.
Grace is God giving you (all) what you (we all) don't deserve.
There is evidence of grace being bestowed upon unbelievers and even the wicked in this temporal world. Some repent and turn to Christ, others don't. However, the choice to reject Christ (and his mercy and grace) prior to dying negates the chance for salvation after death.
Despite the fact that some who don't believe in Christ seem to have success in this life, it is an entirely different story [according to the Bible] when such individuals die without Christ. Why? Because they have chosen to reject God's mercy and grace for salvation. Therefore, they choose to leave this world to live in eternity separated from God forever.
God has done all that is necessary for salvation. Our job here on this earth is to either accept or reject His provision.
__________________
See to it that no one takes you captive through hollow and deceptive philosophy, which depends on human tradition and the basic principles of this world rather than on Christ. Colossians 2:8
The eyes of the Lord move to and fro throughout the earth to show Himself strong to those whose hearts are fully committed to Him. 2 Chronicles 16:9
Posts
4 comments:
Well, that's a good way to get people to read your other pages!
You neglected to quote my reply to your wondering about JP2's neglect.
When one believes (and instructs) that all men are sinners, then that should automatically include ecclesiastics such as oneself. Somehow John Paul II, despite witnessing the treatment of dissidents in his native Poland, failed to realize his duty and clean his own house before setting out to clean up others.
I repeat what I said five years ago:
”...what good will it do, when the papal legates claim diplomatic immunity? What good will it do, when God’s Vice-Regent on Earth is a moral coward who refuses to acknowledge the problem? What good will it do, when co-conspirators such as Bernard Cardinal Law are allowed to leave for the Vatican instead of going to jail?
If God’s sheepherders can’t be trusted to monitor their own behavior, what right have they to dictate to the sheep?”
The fact that there's still investigations going on and new allegations made—after eight years-- shows simply how widespread it has been. Besides, I thought you'd be overcome with joy at all those evil gays being driven from your former faith.
Been a slow day, has it? You only invoke my name and posts when you're stuck for a subject. How about concentrating on what they do, not what I say about it?
GM,
The link is there for people to read the entire thread.
Pope John Paul was a past leader of the Catholic Church. However, it is extremely important to realize that he was not the leader of the entirety of Christianity. That is an important point that you left out. No one pastor, minister, or follower of the Gospel can claim such a position because it only belongs to Jesus Christ.
Second, the fact that the pope thought that the accusations of homosexuality in the priesthood was Communist propaganda may have been at least one big reason why he would not believe that such horrendous acts were happening. As I stated in my comment, I did not know about the pope's thinking process about the abuse cases until I read that WND article.
You neglected to comprehend what I wrote regarding "good" people vs. bad people. The Good Test reveals that none of us are good. As Isaiah wrote: "All of our righteousnesses are as filthy rags." Why? Because compared to God's Holiness, we all fall short of the glory of God.
People who follow untrustworthy "sheepherders" (as you put it) are responsible for their own choices, too. As you pointed out, I left the Catholic church mainly because I studied the Bible and found out the man-made rules of that denomination did not follow biblical exegesis, exhibit solid hermeneutics, nor did the church utilize the necessity of avoiding heresy and apostasy by staying on course via Sola Scriptura. The denomination veered away from the plumbline of what the Scriptures teach and the true, inerrant Gospel that Jesus taught.
However, there ARE saved Catholic Christians (I know some personally) who stay in the church for various reasons - including for the purpose of witnessing within the church. But I'm getting off topic.
You wrote:
Besides, I thought you'd be overcome with joy at all those evil gays being driven from your former faith.
It's amazing how little you know about me - even after all of these years.
The "evil gays" (as you put it) are in desperate need of the Savior, Jesus Christ, just as I, you, and all of humankind are in desperate need of Him. There are NONE who are righteous - no NOT ONE.
Rom 3:10 As it is written: "There is none righteous, no, not one;
In fact, read all of Romans 3. but note these particular verses:
Rom 3:20 Therefore by the deeds of the law no flesh will be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin.
Rom 3:21 But now the righteousness of God apart from the law is revealed, being witnessed by the Law and the Prophets,
Rom 3:22 even the righteousness of God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to all and on all who believe. For there is no difference;
Rom 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,
Rom 3:24 being justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,
Rom 3:25 whom God set forth as a propitiation by His blood, through faith, to demonstrate His righteousness, because in His forbearance God had passed over the sins that were previously committed,
Rom 3:26 to demonstrate at the present time His righteousness, that He might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.
Rom 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? Of works? No, but by the law of faith.
And no. It's not a "slow day" for me nor am I out of ideas for blog posts. Currently, I am caring for my elderly mother and my time is limited online. But I do have a very brief post to share that is quite special. In fact, it made me think, pray, and ultimately gave me a clearer direction for this blog. When I have the time to post it, I will.
Hi GM,
Amid your usual bitterness toward religion, you hit on a worthy question:
"If God’s sheepherders can’t be trusted to monitor their own behavior, what right have they to dictate to the sheep?”
The answer, of course, is no right to "dictate" at all. And so it is. While different church systems on Earth mirror governments, they are like kingdoms without an earthly king. I am free to do or not do anything my pastor says, as is the case in any Christian sect I know. The only "power" given to any Christian is to proclaim the scriptures. As the Word of God, they are the authority. This was one of the reasons that there are several parts of the Gospels where people are surprised about a man teaching "with authority." They knew that the only authority the priests had was to convey the words of God.
"The fact that there's still investigations going on and new allegations made—after eight years-- shows simply how widespread it has been."
That may very well be. For all concerned I hope that every member of every church who is using their office for harm be prosecuted where applicable and rehabilitated if possible. Priesthood is not simply a club. Their first responsibility is to the sheep, not the other shepherds.
Given your stern views, I assume that you must also be for the abolition of all governments since there has been endemic corruption in them as well continually, as well as all businesses, organizations, etc. In fact, considering your demand for perfection and cleansing of all wrong, I imagine you are pretty much for abolishing everything. Please let me know how that is going.
GM,
"Besides, I thought you'd be overcome with joy at all those evil gays being driven from your former faith."
No Catholic roots here, but I'm saddened deeply when any person leaves the church. Granted, they must be removed from a place where they can do harm, but that aside I want as many "evil" people attending church as possible. They certainly aren't going to find what they need to conquer evil outside of the church.
It really amazes me how two-faced Christian haters are. On the one hand, they condemn Christians as being "self righteous" and "holier than thou" for speaking against sin, but at the same time they condemn us for taking in sinners.
There simply is no winning against mindless hatred.
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